Ban on racist and prejudiced theories and on verbal abuse

Project:website
Component:Wiki
Category:task
Priority:normal
Assigned:Unassigned
Status:active
Project wiki:Minguo Community Project
Ticket category:User moderation
Description

I'm submitting a request to make the decision to ban discussion of psychological race known publicly. I think discussion of psychological race is important for understanding historical and current global affairs.

Comments

#1

Title:Censorship of discussion of psychological race» Ban on racist and prejudiced theories and on verbal abuse
Ticket category:+User moderation

I acknowledge the decision to ban Panoramics from using this platform to disseminate a theory which I judged to be racist, prejudiced, and which Panoramics used as an excuse for his incessant ad hominem attacks and insults.

The decision is definitive, and the ban in effect. This ticket is only to be used for me as a reminder to publish a report in the appropriate place (I am not yet sure where to place such notices).

I had privately informed Panoramics a few weeks ago of this decision via private message, while at the same time giving him the possibility to request that I make my decision public. I didn't want to humiliate him publicly, but at the same time, I think it is only healthy for the community as a whole for me to be held accountable for such decisions. I am not perfect. Like everyone, I am bound to make appreciation errors. Thus, some community oversight is welcome.

In a related note, starting today, Panoramics himself is subject to a temporary ban for his constant misuse of his member priviledges in order to post insults, invectives and all sorts of ad hominem attacks, often disguised as sarcasm or satire. Throughout the past few months, I have encouraged Panoramics to focus on policies and solutions. I have made many offers to collaborate on the numerous issues where we apparently agreed (environmental concerns, human rights, democracy, etc.) but almost constantly, Panoramics disregarded such offers but apparently preferred to test the limits of my tolerance towards verbal abuse (which were not aimed at me but at his favourite targets). It appears today that Panoramics has at long last found the limits of my patience.

I plan to enforce a strong policy against personal attacks.

This site is to be used to discuss factual problems and related policies, and more importantly to discuss and promote solutions and better policies, and to disseminate knowledge about such solutions.

#2

Panoramics, should you happen to read this, I've read (or at least, glanced at) all your posts. I did so because, even though I found many of them pointless and gratuitously offensive, I could see hints of your brilliance and kept hoping for something better.

You have a lot of talent, buried under a landslide of anger, bitterness and hatred that makes it impossible for you to communicate with others. I think, in time, you'll learn the value of focus and moderation. If and when that happens, we will all benefit.

Fred Gohlke

#3

I fully agree with Fred's comment, both the negative and the positive aspects.

#4

Fred, you're too sensitive.

Like I told Augustin via email, I like the book function of this site, but my blog content seems to a be a point of disagreement. I've decided to continue using this site for the book function, but I'll just use a different website for my blogging.

#5

Panoramics,
I emailed you:

I have reinstated your account but only so that you can speak for yourself and defend yourself [in this ticket].
I know that I can trust you, so I'm asking you to refrain from posting anything else anywhere else until we have reached a common understanding.

I see that my trust in you was misplaced. I've reverted today's edits for the same reasons as above.

I find it disconcerting that you've prepared a blog solely dedicated to all your vitriolic rhetoric. You apparently completely fail to understand what it is that we so strongly object to, and why we do so. You spend so much time and energy and misplaced creativity to blame other people, point fingers at them and insult them, that you obviously have none left to so some soul searching and re-evaluate your attitude and priorities.

#6

I'm not sure how my level of sensitivity bears on the issue, Panoramics. I suspect I'm not the only one who seeks and appreciates constructive thoughts intended to strengthen society and abhors destructive thoughts, bent only on tearing society apart.

Ahhhh, but don't waste your time on my words. Be on your not-so-merry way.

Fred

#9

Screenshots from my new site dedicated to anger and vitriol:

Image links: https://i.imgur.com/ct1hdlK.png, https://i.imgur.com/dhyvh75.png

Augustin, you were the one who introduced me to your site and encouraged me to make an account.


via @minguoDemocracy

I didn't use your site for many months until you emailed me and told me to start blogging on it:


Image link: https://i.imgur.com/k8xVv9s.png

When I had started blogging on your site, you continued to encourage me to post:


Image link: https://i.imgur.com/ZvDc2J8.png

Then you started censoring content that I thought was important to dispelling fascism:


Image link: https://i.imgur.com/YN1e1Jf.png

Then you banned my account over a satirical article.1

Then you tried to restrict me from access to my own content to hold me psychologically hostage:


Image link: https://i.imgur.com/QMETKEL.png

I gave you two options:


Image link: https://i.imgur.com/ROZtOeV.png

Since you're so busy, I assumed option two was off the table, so I went with option one.

#10

Fred, you're subservient to Dorianism and will attack every group of people except those who are the root of the problem.

Here you attack Jews when I've stated time and time again that the problem is Dorianism and Zionism:

Admittedly, the Jewish people seem to be masters of manipulating public opinion, at least, in the United States, so such an effort would be difficult to start.1

The true masters of manipulating public opinion are the Dorian-types.

I found many of them pointless and gratuitously offensive

You keep saying this, but not once have you pointed out which posts you find gratuitously offensive or provided any reason why.

I could see hints of your brilliance and kept hoping for something better.

What you're hoping for is a form of detached intellectualization that allows you to create the appearance of civility and intelligence but that allows you to avoid real altruism and real work for society. You're dependent on Lucifer worship which comprises Dorianism (which comprises sophism).2 You're dependent on fascism.

#11

Oh, Gee. You've got me all figured out.

Fred

#12

Both of you completely miss the issue by a wide margin.

#14

Fred, I'm just here to try to foster peace and encourage people to use their talents in the right direction.

Augustin, I think what is needed right now is strategies to bring about unity and cooperation so people can work together toward common goals.

#15

#16

There are so many things wrong in the back and forth above, that I don't know where to start.

The title of this ticket reads: "Ban on racist and prejudiced theories and on verbal abuse".
There are three related issues:
1) The actual ban on such unacceptable speech.
2) The fact that currently Panoramics is being moderated and cannot post freely as he used to. The questions are: does Panoramics want to gain his priviledges back and if so, under which conditions can he be allowed to gain them back.
3) My personal handling of the ban.

Let me start then with the third point. I am not only a little upset and resentful, Panoramics, that you somehow forced me into becoming a moderator and a censor. It is a role that I don't enjoy at all and that I didn't expect to have to perform so soon. As I told you several times before, I'd rather spend my limited time on more constructive endeavours, in a more cooperative spirit towards a common goal.

Since, like Fred, you apparently have no qualms in quoting the content of personal emails and sharing personal and confidential messages with third parties, allow me to comment further on something you quote me as saying.
I wrote:

I trust our collective intelligence much better than my singular person.

I am fallible and regularly make mistakes. I am quite certain that my handling of the situation is not optimal, probably far from it. I shall always be open to constructive, well-meaning criticism.

Here we are, three individuals who each claim wanting to improve our democracies (US, Canada and France). And yet despite our apparent common goals, we have completely failed to unite forces and instead we keep letting our respective egos and petty disputes get in the way. It is a collective failure. We lose by default. We really do have to find a way to allow our collective intelligence to shine through.

But before we can do so, I must learn to do a better job as a host, as a moderator and, as a censor, since it is apparently necessary. And you, Panoramics, must understand what is it that we so strongly object to, why we do, and you must gain back our trust. I really despise my role as a censor and I am really looking forward to achieve something more positive, with or without your help. Preferably with.

I'll come back to comment on the first two points another day.

#17

Ohhhhh, you want an example of something that's gratuitously offensive, do you? Try this for size:

"What you're hoping for is a form of detached intellectualization that allows you to create the appearance of civility and intelligence but that allows you to avoid real altruism and real work for society. You're dependent on Lucifer worship which comprises Dorianism (which comprises sophism).2 You're dependent on fascism."

I believe it's time for me to leave this discussion.

Fred

#18

Augustin:

Right now, I'm pretty happy with just using en.minguo.info to share my views using the book feature and doing my daily blogging outside of this site.

As for quoting emails, I take out all personal information. For example, I would black out personal telephone numbers, home addresses, health information, or personal information unrelated to the particular topic.

Fred: I'm just here to try to foster unity and encourage people to use their talents in the right direction.

#19

Am I the only one who is interested in addressing the real issue?

Panoramics, you are still not addressing the heart of the problem. Your violent, completely unfair ad hominem attacks against Fred as seen above are an example of what's wrong. Never did I mention that you were banned from blogging here. In the context of the current ticket, the distinction you make between the book and the blog features of this site prove that you miss the point. What I don't know is whether you do it on purpose, whether it's a question of bad faith, or whether you are somehow bipolar and your right hand does not seem to be aware of what your left hand is doing.

Your problem is that I am no longer fooled by the strong elements of sophistry in your language. I am dumbfounded by a few of your statements above, where you are obviously trying to deflect the criticism by putting things upside down and by redirecting the accusation (Fred being in this case your chosen victim).

What are your objectives? What do you hope to achieve? What is your motivation for being part of this community?

#20

"Your violent, completely unfair ad hominem attacks against Fred as seen above are an example of what's wrong."

Does Fred need some ice for his black eye?

#21

Nah. No problem. You missed.

Fred

#22

When you don't understand sarcasm:

Nah. No problem. You missed.

Fred

Augustin, I haven't made any ad hominem attacks against Fred, nor have I used violence seeing as how I'm on the internet. I've made my criticisms of Fred clear. He made his criticisms of me clear. Do you want me to be honest or do you want me to lie?

Fred, I'm just here to encourage people to use their talents in the right direction and to foster unity among people (minus slave-makers of course).

#23

I have a very busy day today. I'll do my best tomorrow to reply in detail to many of the comments above.

As long as both of you remain in the realm of attack to the person and egotic self-defense, no progress can be made on the real issues which are the only things that matter to me.

#24

I want the ability to edit the content of my book. I find that this site encourages censorship more than free speech. This site has a safe, liberal facade but uses fascist tactics to silence dissent and proper discourse.

I also want an apology for being accused of violence.

#25

Panoramics, start by addressing our concerns and answering the questions I asked you above.

Verbal violence (verbal abuse) is a form of violence, and ad hominems attacks are a form of verbal violence.

#26

Violence involves physical force. Abuse can be verbal and physical.

What are your objectives? What do you hope to achieve? What is your motivation for being part of this community?

I've already made my intentions for being part of this group very clear. I want to help shift society toward real civilization: